Robert Soroka, a criminal attorney and teacher at Concordia and Dawson has lived through both the Polytechnique massacre of 1989 and the more recent Dawson tragedy. He speaks to The Concordian about safety in schools, gun control and helping students move forward.
Where were you the day of the Dawson shooting?
I was on my way out of the office to the Atrium to grab a coffee before my class. It occurred to me that I should review some material prior to my class as time would be very limited, given that we had planned the now infamous pizza party. I opened up my computer at which point I heard shots. I looked out my window and saw a police officer with his firearm in hand and I heard more shots. I knew they were shots as I have heard gunshots before in my previous life as a criminal attorney. At that point, I ran out of my office and I proceeded to alert all the classrooms. It was approximately 12:42 or 12:43 p.m. and the 11:30 classes let out at 12:45 p.m. so it was imperative that we kept the students from leaving. I had no idea where the conflict was in the school and we had no idea how many gunmen there were so we kept everyone barricaded in the classrooms. I returned to my office and called my wife because I knew she would hear about this very soon and, of course, worry. She was very emotional and insisted I lock myself in the office at which point I told her, “I can’t do that, I have a responsibility.” I made sure anyone in the corridor got into classrooms. Some other colleagues and I kept vigil; waiting for what would, hopefully, be the police arriving. We must have heard between 20 and 30 shots fired, never certain where the shots were [coming from]. And I guess about 40 minutes after the first shot, the police got to our floor [fourth floor] and, covering us with their weapons, directed [us] to an exit. I can assure you that there were several other teachers who did exactly as I did. Professor Rosario Lo Raso was on the third floor – immediately under me, and he did precisely what I did. We’ve also heard of several acts of true heroism by the security guard who was in the Atrium at the time. One of the physical education teachers administered first aid to a shot student, putting his life at risk because no one knew where the gunman was. Another teacher positioned himself under the escalators pushing students to safe areas. I haven’t heard of any teacher who put their own interests ahead of the students.
What did you do after police intervened?
After I was evacuated, I had heard that students were being diverted to Concordia and, as my car was sequestered at Dawson, I just started walking east to Concordia and passed by the pizza shop where we had ordered the pizzas from, which never made it here but were all prepared. I picked up the pizzas. Myself and the delivery guy drove from his pizza shop to Concordia and delivered pizzas to members of the CSU, hoping the Dawson students would be at Concordia, if they wanted something to eat.
How has the incident affected you personally?
Although we all feel terribly for the student who was slain, one of the hardest parts of all this, [is that] one of my former students came back that day to attend the pizza event, as did several other former grads. He was shot. As painful as everything is, this one hits very close to home.
Do you see any similarities between the Dawson shooting and the Polytechnique one?
Well, here you have two very disturbed fellows who knew that when they entered the institutions, they wouldn’t be leaving alive and in both instances, they chose to take people’s lives prior to taking their own.
How has your experience at Polytechnique affect your attitude towards this incident?
Well for one, we knew that students were going to be scarred by this. You know that some students are going to rebound fairly quickly and others are going to have a very difficult time with it. My experience was that students [need] to talk about it but not necessarily in class. [And they] don’t want to discuss it four times a day, five times a week. In one of the classes I taught after Polytechnique, when we discussed the shooting, there was little response. I brought that experience to my department and we did something that I think was very effective. We designated one teacher per sector to discuss the shooting. You know, this is why I have been sensitive to all members of the community; something like this doesn’t just affect Dawson, it affects anyone in the education system. I remember going into class and we had some very traumatized students [from other CEGEPs] who probably didn’t even know where Polytechnique was situated.
In your opinion, are schools lacking adequate safety measures?
It’s very hard for me to see how we can be more secure without turning our school into a fortress. In the Atrium there is a constant security presence. As far as any other security measure goes, the best security is for the members of the school community to be vigilant. We have all lost our innocence. We are painfully aware that no matter how much security we have this could happen again. We have to be vigilant and have, in the back of our minds, a plan as to what we would do in a crisis situation. We, as a society have made certain decisions about our institutions and one of those decisions was not to have armed security patrolling corridors and metal detectors greeting students as they walked in, and quite frankly, if we do a complete 180 turn, will our society be any better for it? I don’t think so. There will, unfortunately, always be disturbed people who will look toward aggression as a means to expressing whatever they’re feeling. We can only hope that we can contain that in some way and, I guess, we’ll leave that to the mental health professionals and whoever else can deal with that kind of thing.
There has been talk about arming security guards in universities across Canada. Do you think this measure is necessary?
An armed security presence comes with its own Pandora’s Box. Before anyone makes a knee jerk decision, things have to be thought through very, very carefully. Armed security guards, metal detectors, any of those things, would not have averted this massacre. This gunman could’ve positioned himself anywhere. This guy was prepared to die that day and he was going to take people with him.
Could this event have been avoided in any way?
There’s no way to foresee something like this. There are disturbed people in the world, they have access to weapons, but to suggest that more could have been done to have averted this is inappropriate.
Do you think the government needs to implement changes?
I think the government should impose changes with respect to gun ownership. Although my experience has been that those people who want to acquire weapons for criminal activities, can do so. In this case here, you have an individual who jumped through all the legal hoops and was able to secure a very potent weapon relatively easily. We’re never going to be able to eliminate the hardcore criminals from acquiring weapons, but we can certainly make it more difficult to acquire weapons in general.
As a parent yourself, do you think parents across the country, particularly in this city, should feel somewhat apprehensive about sending their children to school?
No. I think, its unfortunate to say, but there’s no way that anyone can be 100 per cent protected from the crazies of the world unless they want to isolate themselves entirely and I would say [that] would be the greater loss.
Do you think the media attention Gill received by the media could encourage others to follow through with similar goals?
I think it’s a necessary story, people want to know. It’s unfortunate because likely it’s what he wanted, but people wanted to know. If you want my opinion as to what the media should not have given play to, it’s the press conference between CSU (Concordia Student Union) and the DSU (Dawson Student Union), which, in my opinion, generated frivolous statements with no foundation.
Looking back on what happened at Dawson, what observations can you share with us?
I could tell you that this institution could not have reacted better, from the administration to the faculty and staff, everybody has done an incredible job of trying to get this institution back to as close a normal state as it can be. What I observed in terms of planning and organization in the planning and aftermath, it’s hard to fathom that it did not take a year to put all that together. As well, the police acted with incredible heroism and bravery, literally walking into a situation of which they had no idea what to expect was, in my opinion, worthy of the highest honours our country could bestow. They certainly learned from the Polytechnique incident and they’ve said so themselves. That’s why there was only 21 injured. There could have been many more.
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